Sony bans homebrew talk from its official forums
After months (nay, years) of homebrew chatter on Sony's very own PlayStation Forums, it appears that Sony is finally cracking down. With the launch of the PSP-2000 at hand, it appears that Sony wants people to become oblivious to the world of homebrew, due to system security and piracy concerns. "Homebrew applications void the warranty of the PSP®(PlayStation®Portable) system, and an official area to discuss such activities cannot be provided by SCEA. Any postings that are clearly homebrew-related, such as those providing instructions on downgrading firmware updates, will be removed from this board ... Any posting found to be in violation of this policy is subject to an immediate deletion. Members who continue to violate this policy may be subject to an immediate ban from this community, or other disciplinary actions as determined by the community Administrators."It looks as though Sony is serious about wiping out homebrew, at least on its own turf. Boo! We were going to start a homebrew column here on PSP Fanboy. Does that mean we'll get in trouble from Sony?
[Via Games Radar]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Alien @ Sep 6th 2007 11:14AM
Duh ... what where you expecting , seriously ... I was pretty amazed that this didnt happened sooner :?
Colin @ Sep 6th 2007 11:35AM
Homebrew is a euphemism for piracy...piracy hurts legit PSP owners by making developers wary of sinking money into new games. Go Sony.
Re: Homebrew column...please don't.
MCKWZ @ Sep 6th 2007 11:43AM
Homebrew is a great way to checking out other games made by the people!
Re: Homebrew column...please yes!
And please keep us posted about the development of the downgrading process of the PSP 2000.
Ed @ Sep 6th 2007 11:53AM
Based on what I have seen from the homebrew community, I'm inclined to agree with Colin.
Hector Martinez @ Sep 6th 2007 11:55AM
Good thing I got my own forums to discuss it.
gullum @ Sep 6th 2007 11:55AM
Thank you sony. The forums were full of elevnteen year olds asking when the downgraders are being released and just want homebrew so they don't have to pay for games. Finally, I don't have to put up with that crap.
I posted a tutorial on how to get back to Sony fw from homebrew fw and was flamed with "Sony fw sucks why would anyone want it" so I say good riddance to bad rubbish!
wheatshelf @ Sep 6th 2007 12:12PM
PSP + BookR * The Gutenberg Project = The best thing a college kid can do with his time. Cheers for homebrew. Sucks to the people who don't respect it.
4ham @ Sep 6th 2007 12:16PM
@Colin - Your views on homebrew make it clear you have no idea what it is.
Anyways, I was surprised it lasted as long anyhow on the official Sony forums. I guess in a way it was their way of keeping an eye on things and picking up on what was possible(How long till Sony releases a real themes package and manager for the XMB?)
XenoPhage @ Sep 6th 2007 12:25PM
This whole homebrew=piracy thing is so overblown. While I'm sure there are programs out there to rip and play PSP games, I can't say that I've ever seen one. All I've ever seen publicized are the custom firmwares and true homebrew apps that aren't pirated programs.
Homebrew is a great way for new developers to access the platform. I really wish Sony would follow in Microsoft's footsteps and develop a decent homebrew program. (yes, I think I threw up a little there. In all sincerity, though, Microsoft does seem to be making some headway in the homebrew scene)
I think if you really looked hard at it, you'd find far less pirates in the console scene than you would in the PC scene, so I hardly think piracy is that much of a problem here.
ryan @ Sep 6th 2007 12:33PM
I just wish there was a way for homebrew to exist without piracy. And while we're wishing, an official Sony approved way to play games without the UMD while somehow not enabling piracy.
required @ Sep 6th 2007 12:38PM
finally!
Colin @ Sep 6th 2007 12:40PM
@4ham...
I write simplistically for people like you.
Homebrew is absolutely the gateway to piracy...there is NO way to argue against that. Now whether it is 10% or 90% of homebrewers participating in piracy is irrelevant to developers who may not wish to have their hard work go uncompensated.
required @ Sep 6th 2007 12:40PM
I hate the term homebrew
Potent1 @ Sep 6th 2007 12:55PM
Just because something is homebrew, doesn't mean it's piracy. I hate how everyone mingles those two together. Sure there are a lot of pirates, but you don't have to be one.
Saigon @ Sep 6th 2007 1:03PM
"Homebrew is absolutely the gateway to piracy...there is NO way to argue against that. Now whether it is 10% or 90% of homebrewers participating in piracy is irrelevant to developers who may not wish to have their hard work go uncompensated."
Well said.
Random1448 @ Sep 6th 2007 1:05PM
yea, I agree with sony. with the PS3 and PSP out and a video and music download service on the way, I think they want to stomp out piracy as much as possible, which thanx to dumbass's that use ISOs includes homebrew. apple would do the same thing probably faster and more aggressive though, with the ipod and iphone.
fireflymr @ Sep 6th 2007 1:06PM
?? Last year I was banned like 10 times on Playstation.be, so the belgian Playstation Forums, because I was talking about homebrew...
Tim Parsons @ Sep 6th 2007 1:20PM
Good For SONY thay need to focus next on cracking down on and shutting these homebrew poeple down,. and crakcing down on people who use it , some kind of detection software to prevent homebrew PSP's from connecting to the networks,ps3's and other non homebrew psp's. Piracy should not be tolerated under any circumstances!!!
This is a small step but at least it's one in the right direction.
Josh @ Sep 6th 2007 1:32PM
What the hell is going on here? Are people really too stupid to understand the difference between homebrew (running software created by independant programmers. you know, the programming equivilant to all those cool indie bands kids talk about these days) and pirating software?
Colin posted above "Homebrew is absolutely the gateway to piracy...there is NO way to argue against that" but is apparently blind to how meaningless of a statement that is. Hey, you know what? The Windows operating system is absolutely the gateway to pirating because running it on a computer allows you to run whatever code you put on it. In fact, it is ten times easier to run pirated software on Windows/Linux/OSX than to run pirated software on a homebrew enabled PSP, yet where are the legions of Sony-led douchbags raging against them?
Would you perfer a world in which the manufacturer of your PC has ultimate decison on what programs you are allowed to run on it? Would you like to put all those young programmers getting a start in the business out on the street by promoting your closed-minded views? Applying your homebrew mindset beyond the PSP proves that you know nothing about the world of software development.
Signed,
A PSP homebrew user who payed his own earned money on every piece of software he has loaded on it, and believes in the right of people to make full use of the hardware they pay for, as they see fit, within the lay of the law.
cafecito @ Sep 6th 2007 1:33PM
What can I say? I agree with Sony, at least on their "turf" issue. They don't have to tolerate CF talk on their boards.
Homebrew is okay and all as a concept, but who are you trying to kid? As of late CF is synonymous with piracy... and it's starting to affect sales. I buy my share of games, but I cannot support the industry by myself you know.
Bout the homebrew board: Dunno...is it necessary? I would preferable avoid it.
upz @ Sep 6th 2007 1:34PM
"This whole homebrew=piracy thing is so overblown. While I'm sure there are programs out there to rip and play PSP games, I can't say that I've ever seen one. All I've ever seen publicized are the custom firmwares and true homebrew apps that aren't pirated programs."
Open your eyes.
Saigon @ Sep 6th 2007 2:11PM
"Colin posted above "Homebrew is absolutely the gateway to piracy...there is NO way to argue against that" but is apparently blind to how meaningless of a statement that is"
Actually it *does* mean something. Homebrew allows pirates to download games, period. How exactly is that meaningless?
Yes, piracy is significantly more rampant of PCs. But the thing is, it's too out of control to stop on pcs, as opposed to psp.
How difficult is it to understand that developers want their investment protected. I don't care how much money developers are losing in sales, wheter it be a little or alot, they're still LOSING money in sales. Sony understands that, which is why they try to stop hackers. Yeah, homebrew programmers would get screwed, and not be able to demonstrate, or advance their respectable skills. But you know what, most of us bought our psps for official games, and not for little apps, or homebrew games(most of which, I've *personally* thought sucked...except for PSPR). If homebrew needs to be stopped, in order to prevent piracy, then EVERYONE should be able to understand what Sony is doing here.
Once AGAIN, retarded homebrew users have misconstrued Sony actions, as an attack on their precious homebrew scene, instead of being rational, and seeing what it really is, another action against piracy.
cj2112_cj2112 @ Sep 6th 2007 2:41PM
Sony has every right to protect the investments that they make in their hardware and software. They also have an obligation to non-Sony companies that also invest to develop software for the PSP to protect their revenue stream.
That being said, Sony continues to walk a fine line between protecting the profitability of its enterprises vs. developing products that meet the market demand.
Their abandonment of ATRAC in its minidisc line is an example of the types of problems that plague the company. As a PSP user I want the freedom to play games on the PSP that were developed for the PSP, like Tecmo Bowl. Sony is restricting my ability to do this - again, this is within their right but I don't want to feel like they are consistently choosing what is profitable over what their users want.
Ratchet the Lombax @ Sep 6th 2007 2:49PM
"Yes, piracy is significantly more rampant of PCs. But the thing is, it's too out of control to stop on pcs, as opposed to psp." I think it is a little late for Sony to think that they can stop piracy on the PSP. Since all their attempts up till this point have failed what with all the firmware updates that have "strengthened security" as a feature.
Also I don't see how piracy can be the reason for poor game sales on the PSP. After all if I wanted to for as little as $40 I could buy a DS flash cart and get all the DS games for free. It's a lot easier to pirate games on the DS but they seem to be selling millions of games.
Anyway, I don't care what they do on the playstation boards as I have never even been there. So if they want to ban CFW/Homebrew discussion fine it isn't like there aren't other places to go. And yes I am a homebrew user but I don't pirate games I just use it to play the games and use the apps that people make for it.
GoBob @ Sep 6th 2007 2:58PM
I'm a custom firmware user who buys all his games and I'm getting a kick out of these replies.
Look, everyone on both sides is just pissing in an ocean of piss until Sony makes an official firmware that both allows homebrew and prevents piracy.
To the anti-homebrew people: Assuming that all homebrew does is support piracy is idiotic. There are a lot of creative programmers out there who make all sorts of homebrew from homemade games to programs that allow you to customize your XMB. If anything, it's the ISO loaders that are the root cause of piracy, NOT homebrew programs. If custom firmwares did not have these loaders, there would be next to zero issues with piracy. If you're going to bitch, bitch about CFWs with ISO loaders, NOT homebrew programs.
To the pro-homebrew people: Assuming that all
users of custom firmwares don't practice piracy is idiotic. It's too easy to do. I'd like to think the majority of the CFW users on here don't pirate, but I'm pretty sure a lot do. Just please buy what you like and delete what you don't like. Remember that Sony did express that they would like to create a firmware that allows homebrew and prevents piracy. Let's hope it will happen.
tl;dr Don't make broad generalization based on little research. That's for both sides of the issue.
merc25 @ Sep 6th 2007 3:00PM
""Homebrew is absolutely the gateway to piracy...there is NO way to argue against that. Now whether it is 10% or 90% of homebrewers participating in piracy is irrelevant to developers who may not wish to have their hard work go uncompensated."
Well said."
What horrible logic. Hey! I have a great idea, let's ban the Internet cause it's a "gateway" to piracy.
What the hell happened to this place? Used to be that most people here were homebrew users, now we have been invaded by retard brigade who don't research or look into anything.
Hombrew is not piracy (now repeat that phrase, until it sinks through your thickheaded skulls into that poor excuse of a brain you possess).
The industry says they lose money from piracy, are we to believe them? There is no(scientific) way of measuring the rate of piracy or the effects of it(other than new DRM technology). How do we know that the developer didn't make a crappy game, and is just blaming piracy for low sales? there are many factors that go into what makes people buy a product.
1. Quality of the product
2. Quantity of product available locally
3. Marketing of the product(this is a big one)
4. The price of the product and how much expendable cash Joe Average has on hand(another big one)
5. do you need other items to use the product(i.e. console, microphone, memory sticks, wifi connection, etc...)
6. the competition's products
7. rental and used game industry for this scenario
I personally don't buy many newly release games, because I'm in college and a cheapskate. Most of my games(half of my PSP games) have been out for 6-12 months.
As for the homebrew column about time for it. Most of the homebrew I used is software stuff(note:I'm making a distinction between games and software).
ManaKnight @ Sep 6th 2007 3:19PM
Awesome. It really upsets me about people discussing Homebrew on the official forums. I only want people to use their PSP for what it was used for, Official Sony stuff and PSP games. I love my PSP and refuse to run any Homebrew.
Don @ Sep 6th 2007 3:21PM
The problem was, moderators would ban legitimate PSP-related threads, yet any little thing related to homebrew was not only accepted, but encouraged (with the exception of ISOs)
I don't mind homebrew talk, but about time that Sony started taking care of their own forums. Now if only they could get some real moderators instead of the idiots that are running the place now... otherwise it will always be the joke that it is. That's the REAL problem.
snake79 @ Sep 6th 2007 3:35PM
I agree with Colin. Maybe homebrew was not meant for piracy but it is now what's enabling piracy. 90% or even more of the psp owner in my country only play pirated game thanks to the homebrew. I hope that there is a way that homebrew and anti piracy could co-exist but if there is no other way homebrew have to go. Or maybe they could serial number their game for online game play so that each UMD have their own ID and no multiple same ID can be use to log in online. Well, maybe this could stop a little bit of the piracy but not all... :\
Tim Parsons @ Sep 6th 2007 3:49PM
@19 the PSP isnt a PC there's a big difference,. and considering all Homebrew out there and vorrect me if i'm wrong enables you to play pirated PSP games and how many of those who use homebrew on the PSP don't do it mainly for Pirating games?? Very few lie if you like.!
Saigon @ Sep 6th 2007 4:02PM
"Also I don't see how piracy can be the reason for poor game sales on the PSP."
"The industry says they lose money from piracy, are we to believe them?"
I personally don't know/care how much they're losing, but they ARE losing money to piracy. To say otherwise, or believing it to be a lie is just plain stupid. My point is that devs aren't getting all the money they've worked to earn.
"It's a lot easier to pirate games on the DS but they seem to be selling millions of games."
Since when was ordering online(something which I doubt a large portion of ds users are able to do), external hardware(i.e. a flashcard for slot 1) more easier then changing something within the flash, using software?. Even if was easier to pirate for the ds, and it didn't affect ds game sales, it still wouldn't matter, because developers are still losing money they've earned!
"What horrible logic. Hey! I have a great idea, let's ban the Internet cause it's a "gateway" to piracy."
Wow, your mind is brilliance at work! /sarcasm
1. Banning the internet!?!? LMAO
2. Comparing the *internet* to homebrew makes me laugh even more.
3. Are you saying it would be stupid for Sony to 100% eliminate piracy, by stopping homebrew?
"Hombrew is not piracy (now repeat that phrase, until it sinks through your thickheaded skulls into that poor excuse of a brain you possess)"
I NEVER said that. In fact, I don't even recall anyone else saying that either. Is it time for your chill pill?
C
GoBob @ Sep 6th 2007 4:05PM
For the record:
Homebrew is a term frequently applied only to video games that are produced by consumers on proprietary game platforms; in other words, game platforms that are not typically user-programmable, or use proprietary hardware for storage. Sometimes games developed on official development kits, such as Net Yaroze or PS2 Linux are included in the definition. Some, however, also refer to all non-commercial, "home-developed" games for open architectures as homebrew games, though these typically go under more frequently used labels, such as freeware. The term doesn't, however, include commercially sold games that are developed without the console manufacturer's license.
Homebrew as a whole as it is defined does not mean piracy-enabling. In the PSP world, ISO loaders are the specific homebrew programs that allow users to run ISOs, leading to potential piracy. Homebrew is merely user-created programs.
As a side note, I guarantee that every single anti-homebrew person on here has committed non-PSP piracy at least once. Especially since most seem to think that PC piracy gets special treatment as opposed to PSP piracy.
pixelator @ Sep 6th 2007 4:53PM
I don't agree that homebrew equates piracy all the time, but there IS a piracy problem on the PSP and Sony is well within their rights to request people not talk about non-official FW and so forth on their forums. Not unreasonable.
The negative slant PSPF takes on this news (which is starting to eerily echo the 'Sony can do no right' tone of Engadget/Joystiq, FYI) is borderline irresponsible. Sony clamping down on piracy will HELP the whole 'will this come out on PSP?' problem we're starting to have. If publishers think the platform is not secure, they're history and there goes the future.
Want the PSP to stick around so you have more games to enjoy into next year and the next? Help staunch the PIRACY problem and don't BITCH like a bunch of SPOILED BRATS when Sony tries to tighten FW loopholes. Until there's an 'open firmware' that allows homebrew but NOT pirated ISO's (never gonna happen), this is just the way it's got to be.
Goddamned whiners.
Abscissa @ Sep 6th 2007 5:10PM
"Homebrew is absolutely the gateway to piracy...there is NO way to argue against that." - Colin
"Good For SONY thay need to focus next on cracking down on and shutting these homebrew poeple down,. and crakcing down on people who use it" - Tim Parsons
"I only want people to use their PSP for what it was used for, Official Sony stuff and PSP games. I love my PSP and refuse to run any Homebrew." - ManaKnight
Gee, now why do I get the feeling that Colin, Saigon, Tim Parsons, upz, and ManaKnight all work for Sony?
I have to commend cj2112_cj2112 and GoBob for what are probably the most intelligent treatments of the issue that I've seen. I also have to agree fairly strongly with merc25. However, in response to his statement "What the hell happened to this place? ...now we have been invaded by retard brigade", I *seriously* think it's not really been invaded by people that really are that stupid, but rather been invaded by Sony's guerrilla PR team. And then a handful of real people just happened to be stupid enough to believe "Sony's Bullshit Brigade". Hey, it's not like Sony hasn't been caught red-handed pulling that sort of shit before, right? ("All I want for Christmas...")
"I NEVER said that. In fact, I don't even recall anyone else saying that either." - Saigon, in response to "Homebrew is not piracy"
Umm, yes, that statement WAS made. For instance, in post #2:
"2. Homebrew is a euphemism for piracy...
...
Posted at 11:35AM on Sep 6th 2007 by Colin"
Josh @ Sep 6th 2007 5:17PM
Once again, you people are not getting the point. Okay, your main point is that hombrew is the enabler of piracy.
First off, as someone else mentioned, the internet is an even bigger enabler, it's where you get the pirated software, however no one would sacrifice their access to the internet to make SONY's profit margins better.
Then why the hell should anyone sacrifice their right to homebrew? You payed for the machine, why should you not be able to use it as you see fit? The burden should not be on THOSE OF US WHO USE HOMEBREW RESPONSIBLY to protect Sony. This would be like cutlery companies making going after people for using bread knifes to cut their meat at dinner. It is simply not their place to do so. Yes, Sony should be able to protect it's assets. It should not, however, be allowed to do so at the detrimet of paying customers.
Seriously, when did the world get so complacent to the whims of multinational corporations that really don't give a fuck about you or I?
MasterREAVer @ Sep 6th 2007 5:25PM
oh my god,what a bunch of idiots here....
ofcourse sony bans homebrew from it's topic...no question to that, but after reading the posts you people wrote here, i mean.. goash... the ignorance is ... overwhelming.. homebrew isn't equilant with piracy, altough lots of people tend to hide behind this sentence... and even piracy is OK to a level, cause I download the game before I buy it, to try what'll I get for my money... because in my Country we work about 1,5-2Days to be able to buy 1 misreable UMD......so I guess you can understand why I can't just buy every title, and there are very few Demos. So if there are people like me, our piracy problem would be solved if every game would get a demo, so there won't be any reason for a CFW....well this is my short opinion.
GoBob @ Sep 6th 2007 5:44PM
@Abscissa
"I *seriously* think it's not really been invaded by people that really are that stupid, but rather been invaded by Sony's guerrilla PR team. And then a handful of real people just happened to be stupid enough to believe "Sony's Bullshit Brigade". Hey, it's not like Sony hasn't been caught red-handed pulling that sort of shit before, right? ("All I want for Christmas...")"
OK, so I'm not crazy then. =D I thought it was weird that a large amount of anti-homebrew comments came up out of the blue.
pixelator @ Sep 6th 2007 6:24PM
I was a developer for 15 years - wasn't particularly fond of Sony. Worked on one PS2 game (which sucked). Owned a few CLIE PDA's and the best portable CD player ever made, the D-555. Sony has had its ups and downs.
Nowadays, I manage a retail store and game (mainly WoW and my PSP).
I'm not a Sony shill or anything else of the sort, but even I (and I've pirated more than my share of games in my time) see the reason behing Sony trying to CALM THE FEARS OF DEVELOPERS who may have cause for concern. Look at the DS - you need to BUY HARDWARE to pirate games on that thing. Not the PSP, all you need is an internet connection. See the problem? If the video game industry sees the PSP as a hotbed of piracy (whether or not it really is), the gig is up and the platform is dead. No more games, no more publishers willing to take a multi-million dollar risk on a system that has a shitty attachment rate.
You can blame Sony for making the thing hackable in the first place and argue that most homebrewers are anti-piracy all you want - but the fact is, as long as that back door's open, the commercial developer community is going to stay nervous. Some of us here would rather that homebrew be killed off than the PSP be killed off. If I had a choice between a new Castlevania or Final Fantasy game next year and a host of emus and loaders, I'd choose the new commercial games, thanks very much. I've had plenty of Gameparks and Zodiacs already - I want my handheld game system to be SUPPORTED.
Homebrew and the all-out attack on the security of the PSP through FW hacks is AT ODDS WITH COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT. Don't believe me? Keep supporting FW hacks and ridiculing Sony for trying to keep the PSP safe from piracy. See where it gets us.
Talk about SHORT SIGHTED.
Tim Parsons @ Sep 6th 2007 6:32PM
I Hope SONY really Cracks down on Homebrew and Piracy, they need to make their hardware more secure to prevent it and have some kind of detection on each new disk updating as time goes on to catch systems with it and simply not Run.
rockeranimefreak @ Sep 6th 2007 6:48PM
Homebrew rocks.
RE:Hombrew forums: yes would be awesome :) but no talk of pirates.
merc25 @ Sep 6th 2007 7:42PM
pixelator, I do see your point, but my main beef is that the Industry tries to blame the failure on only one aspect of the equation.
I'd like to clarify my statement: "Used to be that most people here were homebrew users, now we have been invaded by retard brigade who don't research or look into anything.", for it implies that every non-homebrew user is a member of this retard brigade(which they aren't).
Tim, I believe that is illegal here in America, from the way you describe it, that is what most call a computer virus. Can you add a bit more detail to it, like which of the two items(the PSP or the disc) won't be able to run?
Saigon, you completely miss my point.
1. & 2. Why do you laugh? It is a legitimate comparison. Both have a light side allowing users to access legal activities, and both possess a dark side allowing users to commit illegal activities.
3. "Are you saying it would be stupid for Sony to" completely "eliminate piracy, by stopping" the Internet?
How do you like my word play, Saigon.
We'll(referring to homebrew advocates and homebrew detractors) probably never convince people on other side of the fence, that our side is the correct side no matter what we say.
Saigon @ Sep 6th 2007 8:58PM
3. "Are you saying it would be stupid for Sony to" completely "eliminate piracy, by stopping" the Internet?
Ok.... The only difference, is what I'm saying is actually possible. Sony could(most likely never) stop homebrew, which would in turn prevent piracy. Sony could eliminate the internet, how exactly? Better yet, name anyone who has the power to eliminate the internet.
"How do you like my word play, Saigon."
Well, it sucked in itself, and you also used it to dodge my question.
"Saigon, you completely miss my point."
No, you seem to be missing my point. My main point through all these posts, is that if in order to stop piracy, we need to elimate homebrew, then it should be done. I think you believe that I hate homebrew, when I actually like it. I have a hombrew psp. The main reason why I installed homebrew, was to rip my psx collection. I've also got some homebrew games and apps, like psp revolution, psptube, bookr, academic aid, etc.
Yes, both the internet and homebrew are enablers of piracy. But with homebrew, it's actually possible to stop. If Sony could prevent people from hacking their firmwars, then piracy(and homebrew) would be done with. But the internet, no one can stop the freakin' internet. lol Also, this whole comparison thing, has nothing to do with my aforementioned main point.
This arguement has really gone downhill. We got idiots(lots of whom, sound like 12yo kids) calling people sony PRs, members of some retard brigade, and some other amusing insults.
Merc25, I commend for approaching this argument in a mature manner. Because your fellow homebrew enthusiasts, seem to have made complete asses of themselves. Pixelator, I completely agree with what you said. It's a shame most of these people couldn't seem able to grasp the points we were trying to make.
Jeremy @ Sep 6th 2007 10:49PM
It's actually funny, I actually got banned from the official Sony forums last year for complaining about all the "homebrew" talk, which actually wasn't so much about "homebrew" (most of which is on part with flash games) but downgroading firmware and playing pirated games.
If people were interested in actual "Homebrew", they would be buying an open source handheld, like the GP2X and its ilk.
Abscissa @ Sep 7th 2007 1:49AM
"Seriously, when did the world get so complacent to the whims of multinational corporations that really don't give a fuck about you or I?" - Josh
That's been a pet peeve of mine lately. Somewhere around Generation Y, from what I've seen :(. Man, whatever happened to good old-fasioned GenX anti-authority? ;)
Umm, also, not to trigger a big witchhunt or anything (just the messenger here), but FWIW, there is *a* Tim Parsons that has had at least some connection with Sony:
http://www.linkedin.com/in/timparsons
@pixelator:
An interesting point. But I have a feeling that despite their official public stance, these companies are less concerned about some occasional piracy, and more concerned about allowing another Activision or Tengen to spring up. That would cut the hardware manufacturer out of the royalty loop, and undermine the basic business model that consoles have used ever since the NES/Famicom.
One could argue that this couldn't be the case since Sony (and MS) has official ways for non-licensed developers to get code running on their systems (Net Yarzoe, PS2/3 Linux, XNA). But those always have leashes of one type or another that can keep that possibility in check.
However, I do fully believe in a consumer's right to use a device they bought and paid for however they see fit. So, I'd like to see homebrew force a new business model that doesn't pit consumer and business interests at quite such odds. Game developers have been talking for years about the need for a new business model. I've seen statements as blunt as "The current business model sucks." This exercising of consumer's rights could be the catalyst for some much-needed change.
Spherical @ Sep 7th 2007 6:27AM
@ Saigon and pixelator - I’m with you both all the way about homebrew…
I do believe there is a small percentage of PSP owner’s out there that use homebrew for personally uses and don’t use it for pirating games, but that is a very small percentage.
One of my mates uses his PSP just to pirate game ISO onto it. I argued with him so much about it, telling him that it hurts sales etc for the companies but he didn’t give a shit. (This is a prime example of what homebrew is doing to the PSP. I don’t talk to the wanker anymore for obvious reasons. I use to copy games many years ago, not because I wanted to play them, just because I wanted to build my list more and more. I came to a point and thought… WTF? Why do I need these games and why am I not helping support the game industry like I used to back in the MegaDrive and SNES days?
I’ve always believed in this… If you give, you will reek the rewards.
I work for a huge company and I’m asked so many questions from customer’s wanting to know. “How do I downgrade my firmware to played copied PSP games?” or “Do you sell any PSP consoles with firmware 1.5 etc? All the time I get asked these questions… (It’s a serious problem and you can’t hide behind the fact that homebrew is where it is at)
Sony has all the right to stop this, and we as consumers should be preventing it…
Yes I believe there should be some kind of support for homebrew which Sony is trying to take certain steps in… BUT... If who ever is using the PSP and playing ISO on it should go crawl into their little hole and never come out (You are killing the game sales for the PSP) And don’t give me you sad excuse that you can’t afford games or you wish there were more demos out there… Here’s a pointer… You can’t afford the games? Then you shouldn’t own a system or better still, get a job that pays more money! You want demos? Read reviews or do research on the net…
Plain and simple. There goes those lame excuses down the crap hole.
Do you want a future for the PSP everyone?
Do you want to keep giving support for pirating games for the PSP?
Do you want developers to continue making games for the PSP and support the system?
I’m hoping most of you answered YES, NO and YES…
And Mr Spoon… You can shove you PSP homebrew column…
I’m sure I’ve made some people mad at what I posted… Oh well… No harm intended;)
GoBob @ Sep 7th 2007 10:36AM
OK, I am now 100% certain that there are Sony PR people on PSP Fanboy now. The anti-homebrew people seem to agree with each other a little too much and pat each other on the backs a little too often. There's been a lot of anti-homebrew comments within the last two days, which is frankly unusual for this site. Sure, there have been anti-homebrew comments, but not with this sort of volume. It's centering around only a few people and I'm sure a couple of the people who are making short comments that merely blindly agree with anti-homebrew comments are in fact the same people using different emails.
Spherical @ Sep 7th 2007 11:02AM
@ GoBob
What are you saying?
Believe it or not but there are a load of PSP owners out there that don't like homebrew, is that so hard to believe?
I can't stand people that pirate games and I have a perfectly reasonable reason for it.
There is a place for homebrew to manifest and I hope it is noticed by Sony more but there is still the piracy which is hurting game sales.
Oh, and I wish I was a Sony PR… :P
GoBob @ Sep 7th 2007 11:14AM
Boy, that was a fast response. Slow day?
For the record:
IGN user carterman asked "Why not have some homebrew game support?" To which Jack Tretton replied, "I think that is something that is in the works. We certainly see some of the stuff that has been done via homebrew, and it's incredibly creative. And I think we'd like to try and tap into that a little bit more."
Sony likes homebrew, but they hate piracy.
Most PSP users don't even know homebrew is possible. The amount of people who homebrew is actually quite low.
I bought my PSP for homebrew, not piracy.
CNash @ Sep 7th 2007 3:13PM
I don't see why someone can't make a custom firmware iteration that would enable unsigned code but not include an ISO loader. That would solve the homebrew scene's problem of being labeled "pirates", while still allowing legitimate use of the PSP's full capabilities - like its capacity to play every PS1 game and not just the ones that Sony spoon-feed to PS3 owners.
Whether or not such a "piracy-free" CFW is successful would be the true test of users' credibilty.
Abscissa @ Sep 7th 2007 3:54PM
@CNash: An interesting point.
But one potential problem with that (note, I just said "potential", not definite, I'm largely speculating), is that some homebrewers go on to get their games officially licensed and release through normal commercial channels (I've actually seen this happen on the GBA. Sigma Star Saga, for instance.) For those people, it might be of great benefit to have an ISO loader to help make sure their ISOs work properly. (I don't know for sure though, the only homebrew I've done so far was GBA/DS and 2600).