40GB's loss of backwards compatibility explained
SCEE managing director Ray Maguire said Sony will use the money it dedicated towards backwards compatibility to invest in new games or to perhaps lower prices so more gamers can afford to buy a PS3. "It was a big decision, and we know it is a very emotive subject as lots of people think that backwards compatibility is high on the agenda and yet few really use it," he said.
We're not sure how Maguire came to this conclusion, but the PS3's backwards compatibility feature is always one that we've appreciated for a long time. With Sony's commitment to a 10-year life span of its hardware and games still being published for last generation's console, it seems like an odd choice to "cut the cord" at this point.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Paul @ Oct 5th 2007 2:09PM
i NEED backwards compat. thats why i got a 60gb.
Jay @ Oct 5th 2007 2:09PM
if it comes here im definetly getting this for real. i didnt need 4 usb ports or any of those things it lost. give me hdmi, and blu ray playing capabilities and im there. dont need any of them other gizmos. if i want a bigger hard drive il buy one.
Solace @ Oct 5th 2007 2:10PM
i still don't get how they can "cut b/c" if it's all done through software emulation.
i could see them saying that it's not guaranteed, but that'd be like buying a computer and having the manufacturer say that your new computer doesn't have Firefox on it. well, that's fine, but can't i just install the basic program later?
can someone explain...?
Egster @ Oct 5th 2007 2:11PM
If you really want to have BC fork out a 100 euro more and you have it. As well as an extra controller and 2 games. Better deal than the 400 euro consoel if you ask me. Spin it all you like but the fact remains the PS3 just dropped 200 euros in price from 600 to 400 euros.
john @ Oct 5th 2007 2:13PM
"...that backwards compatibility is high on the agenda and yet few really use it,"
Is this guy for real?! What other games beside Heavenly Sword, Resistance and Warhawk are out here that gamers play on their PS3? I dare you to name one.
This, by far, is the absolute worst explanation I’ve heard this year from any executive. I’m speechless
Stef Geiger @ Oct 5th 2007 2:14PM
I think it's a load of crap too. Seems like they're just punishing the consumer for not buying the more expensive version. Kind of like how Intel apparently used to sell the same processor, but underclocked to different speeds at different prices - it costs the same for them regardless.
But I also think people make too big of a deal out of backwards compatibility. I mean, I love games, but how many games for the PS2 have you played (for however many YEARS at this point) that you STILL feel the need to play? I would definitely buy a non-BC PS3 if it'd save me money.
sicklesdawg @ Oct 5th 2007 2:20PM
Cheap People get what you pay For!
coplice @ Oct 5th 2007 2:21PM
@6
FFVII, the only game thats always fun to play through after 10 years
MetalKingSlime @ Oct 5th 2007 2:23PM
man who cares if it isnt b/c? KEEP UR OLD PS2 MINE WORKS FINE AFTER 4 YEARS... i don't mind there's no bc in this new 40gig model and others shouldn't care either. i even have my original ps hooked up even though i don't play it. so who gives a crap if there's no b/c?! sheesh... lmao :)
Valin @ Oct 5th 2007 2:27PM
Its not a big deal I think, I mean don't a bunch of people still have their old PS2's? Did yours suddenly break the moment you got a PS3. Its no big deal unless you only have a PS3 which a lot od people don't. Most people have a PS2 and PS3
coalhalo @ Oct 5th 2007 2:29PM
I'm really glad I bought my PS3 when I did. Backwards compatibility is what I use my PS3 for the most. I own several PS3 titles, but I have a huge library of PS2 games and a bunch of PS games that I still play, alot. I retired my PS2 when I bought my PS3 last January. The only exception was Guitar Hero, but I finally got an adapter that works and I gave my PS2 to our niece and nephew.
I don't want to have a bunch of consoles hooked up if I don't have to. Sony said pre-launch that the PS3 would be fully backwards compatible. But it seems only if you bought the it early when it had a higher price tag.
ymmv @ Oct 5th 2007 2:33PM
I can see Sony's point about cutting the backwards compatibility. It's a feature not a lot of people use once they've got a taste of PS3 gaming. It's also a very redundant feature because everyone with a collection of PS2 games also has a PS2 (duh!). So why don't they simply continue to play PS2 games on an actual PS2....
Maurice M @ Oct 5th 2007 2:36PM
They're full of **** plain and simple.
Does this mean they're cutting all software emulation patches/fixes even for the 60GB and 80GB units if they're moving funding? What about PS Store download titles which pretty much use that? Does this mean they're not going to offer more? Someone needs to get some real details from them here.
ClarkyCat @ Oct 5th 2007 2:37PM
Who the hell is going to want such a gimped console?
And I have a sneaking suspicion that BC being cut here is going to lead to no more BC list updates either, for the consoles that do support it.
Mak @ Oct 5th 2007 2:37PM
My understanding is Backwards Compatbility is going nowehere, there will always be With/Without models on the market, at least I hope so.
BC is very important to me and many others, there are still great PS1/PS2 games, that are still very enjoyable, despite how many great PS3 games there are.
Sony, please don't drop BC, make it optional fine, that is sensible, but don't drop it.
drdre74 @ Oct 5th 2007 2:40PM
All my ps2 games I have look like crap on my PS3 so i dont even play them on it. I'm glad I kept my ps2. People wanted a lower price on the PS3 now that you have it you got something to say. Damn its a no win with you guys. For the price to come down they had to cut cost. Go buy you a PS2 ONLINE for like $50 and be quite.
wonway01 @ Oct 5th 2007 2:42PM
@#3 I think the emulation is just emulating the EE chip that was removed. There are other supporting hardware that looks like is being removed to save money. It wasnt all software emulation. Just software emulating the EE chip. I guess just from readying posts that there is a "GS" chip for video or something that is getting removed.
Now the 80gig isnt losing anything correct so people still have a choice right?
navsimpson @ Oct 5th 2007 2:44PM
I think Sony faced a choice: keep all the features of the PS3 and rely on exclusives and Blu-Ray movies to drive sales; or, cut some of the features, annoying a portion of your user-based, but end up reducing the price and spike sales this Christmas. I bet it was a much-debated choice but it seems like the right one. Europe is probably the most pro-Sony place around, so this way they are going to end up selling more consoles.
Also, this whole 'software emulation' thing still required the PS2's 'GS' graphics chip to be included. While you can get away with taking out the Emotion Engine, there's no way for the RSX to replicate the GS's capabilities with sufficient performance. They've taken the GS out of these new models - that's why this 40GB model can't do backwards compatibility.
ymmv @ Oct 5th 2007 2:48PM
I've got to chime in on the lousy BC on my PS3 too. It's the European model and BC thru software emulation was limited. I wanted to play the Ratchet & Clank series to get into the mood for Ratchet & Clank: Tools of Destruction. It ran fine, but it was also slow ... far too slow to be playable and fun, so I had to go back to my PS2 to replay the game.
So losing the BC is not a big loss, cause it didn't work so great anyway. If you want the real thing, you have to use the real thing, not emulate it thru software.
Sy @ Oct 5th 2007 2:48PM
What other choice do they have if they want to cut cost? Sony can't win no matter what. If you want backward compatibility, fork over an extra c-note. But you can't begrudge Sony for trying to make the PS3 more affordable for consumers.
Sy @ Oct 5th 2007 2:48PM
test
Ruben @ Oct 5th 2007 2:49PM
It would be nice if it was just a little smaller, but they wouldn't do that now, and release an overheating console like some OTHER company. Macrohard
Spoon!! @ Oct 5th 2007 2:49PM
I think this is the beginning of the death of the PS2. They see that MS killed off the Xbox when they released the XB360... so they're following suit to force people's attention onto the PS3.
Dewy9 @ Oct 5th 2007 2:54PM
Well, I won't be getting a 40. There's too many good Star Wars games from the PS2 that I still enjoy.
ymmv @ Oct 5th 2007 2:56PM
"Well, I won't be getting a 40. There's too many good Star Wars games from the PS2 that I still enjoy."
Ehhh ... that PS2 won't vanish into thin air once you buy a PS3... It will stil function, you can still play games on it....
Waruwaru @ Oct 5th 2007 3:04PM
So... There are not many PS3 games worth playing now, and you can't play thousands of the classic/retro titles... How is this suppose to sell the system?
john @ Oct 5th 2007 3:09PM
How many of you in here own a PS3, and only play ps3 titles on it? 1% I assume.
God of War I and II, Shadow of the Colossus, Gran Turismo, Resident evil 4, Dragonball Budokai Tenkachi and most recently finished Silent Hill 3 and Final Fantasy X again for the 5th and 3rd time respectively. I play more Ps2 games on my Ps3.
Frankly some of your alternatives for playing PS2 games such as buying a separate PS2 console and putting it close to ps3 to play its game, is ridiculous at best. Do not defend a decision that defies logic. Companies should listen to their costumers not the other way around. Sony is punishing everyone and in the short and long term, it only hurts them. I too want to see people buying PS3 but you cannot force them to do so when there are better choices out there and you constantly make the situation more and more difficult for average gamers.
Iridium @ Oct 5th 2007 3:10PM
For the majority it does seem that they want BC but never really use it. The only game I'm going to buy that needs BC on my PS3 is God of War 2, however I decided to wait until it hits $20 to buy it.
I'm sure PS1 titles will still work since that has been completely software for a long time. I don't think the PSP has PS1 chips inside and it works fine.
I'm sure Sony is working on a way to emulate the GS but it is not ready yet so for now there is no PS2 BC on the 40GB system. The move cuts a lot of cost in manufacturing the mainboard since a lot of tracers are not needed anymore. I never really understood why the PS3 had 4 USB ports on the front. It should have had 2 on the front and 2 in back.
In the US you're going to get the 40GB at $399 and the 80GB at $499 for Christmas. One will be for people that want a cheap PS3 to play PS3 games and the other will be for the hardcore gamer that wants BC.
Emrah @ Oct 5th 2007 3:15PM
Probably, they want to keep people with 60GB ps3's happy. It's a sort of justification. "Look, I payed more for this PS3 and I have backwards compatibility, 2 extra usbs and a memory card reader.", one can say. Other than that, we all know 2 usb ports (would cost like, erm, 2 dollars at the very most to produce, esp. in the order of millions), a 20GB storage difference (5 -10dollars??), memory card reader (5-10??) would not justify an extra 100euros (140 dollars). It is like buying cars, they don't have electrically operated windows in the 10000usd model but the 14000usd model with bigger engine. They could have added the functionality to 10000usd model but they don't. Not that I am fan of this marketing method, but I guess they felt they needed to show some justification.
john @ Oct 5th 2007 3:16PM
@ 29
"For the majority it does seem that they want BC but never really use it. The only game I'm going to buy that needs BC on my PS3 is God of War 2, however I decided to wait until it hits $20 to buy it."
God of war II is already 20$, at least in Canada. Besides, please stop assuming that people don't play Ps2 games on their Ps3s. do you have a valid source for this claim? I have 4 friends who have PS3 and ALL OF THEM play more Ps2 games that the original PS3 titles. Even during the online games such as Warhawk people complain and say the same.
Bottom-line, a terrible decision which will cost Sony this charismas.
NoRRODhere @ Oct 5th 2007 3:18PM
@ 1
I agree, I play Mortal Kombat Trilogy (ps1 game)and it works fine. MK2 is the best it gets online which is weak. Sony needs MKT online and it would sell like madness. Anyway 40gig ps3 i guess thats cool for people that are worried about another $100...
Egster @ Oct 5th 2007 3:21PM
Hey john, check the metacritic list of games that are out for the PS3, there are like 20+ titles that score 8 or higher.
Maybe on a site like this half of the people owning a PS3 will play PS2 games on it as well. In the big consumer world I doubt it's even 5%.
FrankTheCrank @ Oct 5th 2007 3:26PM
For people who didn't jump on board early...screw you!
I'm glad their cutting the cord. Their right. Most people don't give a shit about BC. Once I get a new system, I don't bother with the older system. And if I do, I usually have the original console.
So now...all you internet babies, go ahead a cry all you want. If you really cared about BC you would go out and get one now.
I have a 20GB PS3 that is now a 160GB PS3 and it has the Emotion Engine built in. I'm good to go.
-viper- @ Oct 5th 2007 3:26PM
People here are idiotic.
Everyone mentions the same old shit:
'Besides Warhawk, HS and Resistance, what else should I play?' Well, there is Motorstorm, Sigma, F1. But....
Well look here you daft twonks:
http://www.metacritic.com/games/ps3/
First party games aren't the only games on the bloody system. There are so many fantastic upcoming exclusives for the PS3 as well.
daniel. @ Oct 5th 2007 3:38PM
i think its a bad idea. but with the slim fit ps2's only being $99, pick one of those up for BC.
i kind of agree, us who NEED BC for our "games that last forever" (like an annual playthrough of xenogears, silent hill 2, the freakin metal gear solids!, and more) are always going to be a niche market in north america.
FM @ Oct 5th 2007 3:42PM
Possibility of a firmware update for software emulation,anyone?
Otsego_Undead @ Oct 5th 2007 3:43PM
@5 John
Uhh. howbout Motorstorm, Ninja Gaiden Sigma, the Darkness....
BUT BESIDES that.. one of my primary reasons for a PS3 WAS BC.
Justin @ Oct 5th 2007 3:43PM
@ 36, or for that SAME 99bucks...pick up a 60GB PS3
ShaggyB @ Oct 5th 2007 3:46PM
#5 how bout Motorstorm it only sold 1 million copies
And once again sony shoots itself in the foot this gen. Welcome to the 40 gig Blu-ray player. Oh yeah itll be a ps3 also, and dont forget in Europe they are Fire saling the 60 gigs and no longer selling those... Is this foreshadowing for america????
bye bye back compat
Bogatron @ Oct 5th 2007 3:47PM
There are a lot of people that will still want to play PS2 games on their PS3 )I'm playing MGS3 on my 60 GB PS3 now). I don't want to have to have an extra console connected for when I want to play a PS2 game. More importantly, PS2 games look like crap on an HD TV when played with a PS2. They look better played with the PS3 because it does both upscaling and smoothing.
I really hope that Sony continues to sell a model with BC.
Parker @ Oct 5th 2007 3:52PM
Some of you people are idiots. You act like Sony has completely done away with BC. They took it out of one model to make it affordable to you cheapskates. Yet here you are still complaining.
You wanted a cheaper model then you need to make sacrifices. You want a the system with all of the bells and whistles then pay the full price.
Solace @ Oct 5th 2007 3:59PM
@Parker
you're missing people's point.
they want a cheaper console AND all the expensive stuff still in it...
...and a pony. i'm sure everyone wants a pony too...
...and until Sony gives them a pony, the PS3 iz tha d00medz!!211!~!
Jakob @ Oct 5th 2007 4:02PM
I don't get why you buy a PS3 to get BC??
I understand why some people find it's annoying, but people is always whining. The same with the iPod touch and iPhone. Doh! The Touch doesn't has a add event button in the calendar. Doh! The Touch doesen't has Bluetooth. Doh! It's an iPod, not a PDA.
The same here, maybe Sony only saved about 30 bucks on every console, but this simple calculation shows this:
30x5.000.000 sold consoles = $150.000.000
sectionz @ Oct 5th 2007 4:21PM
i dont get it .. they cut out the SOFTWARE BC? how? wtf is going on here? How do you cut software based BC?
Pulse-Wave @ Oct 5th 2007 4:22PM
Given the choice between funding backwards compatibility or funding amazing PS3 games, I'll take the latter.
Besides, I've got my 60 gig PS3. I'm good to go.
Juney @ Oct 5th 2007 4:40PM
At first i thought after i bought my 60gb and i heard the 40gb was comming out i felt ripped off but the 60gb at $500 has been the best Value for the PS3 ... you still have full backwards compatability and 60gb hard drive ... plus wifi and memory card slots... im happy with my 60gb
Broken Haiku @ Oct 5th 2007 4:50PM
I could get a PS2, now if I hadn't already SOLD it because Sony promised me backwards compatibility, and that I quite like having games scaled to 1080P.
lenny0487 @ Oct 5th 2007 4:50PM
software BC worked with the GS chip (PS2 GPU) on the PS3, now that they removed it, you cant play PS2 games on the PS3 40gb, for now... They I guarrantee you that by next year we will see %100 software BC. PS1 games right now works like this. we will see PS2 games using real software BC next year
John @ Oct 5th 2007 5:06PM
I don't like this, but if they're really saving a significant amount of money, then good for them. Just keep the BC in the 80GB (or future premium)model so it's not totally gone.
Buzyb77 @ Oct 5th 2007 5:26PM
Damn Sony... you Tell M$ that BC is important to you and you laugh at them then you Yank it out...
So Now
PS3
Minus BC
Minus Two TV Outputs
Minus Rumble....(Sorry Folks it Still will not be out of the box rumble for most people till next year and then you still have to Buy it Seperate)
Minus all Media Cards....
Minus a unified Friends List
Minus a Mill other thing Sony Will do wrong and keep doing wrong...65 Games this Fall= 47 Multiplatfrom games...